I hear the the story a great deal from older believers. Raised in the church, rejected religion as a young adult and then had an epiphany because of some midlife crisis. Just last week I got the story about how god saved some guys marriage. Nice fella.

What I haven’t experienced is meeting someone who was a thoughtful and informed secular thinker who, in the course of our acquaintance found god in this manner.

I resist the urge to create generalizations of my own experience. Preferring to take people at their word if at all possible. I think that if you make someone comfortable and look them in the eye they generally will give you authentic answers about their own perspective. But, on the other hand, being pressed to validate ones convictions with a story I think our brains do some strange things. Including inventing or drastically distorting events to fit with whatever bill of goods we have right now. This is everybody, not just the faithful.

Many of my family members have wavered in their convictions and confessions. Switching church allegiances, faltering toward unbelief, storming out in outrage and so on. But the culture of christianity keeps them roped in. And that’s not my opinion. They admit this. It’s the weddings and funerals and baby dedications and picnics. Many of them have the same reservations about scripture and church politics that I do. They simply don’t have anything to replace the social network. And they fear the scandal and fallout that is a certainty if they make a public exit.

I know dozens of people whom I get along with swimmingly. For decades. In all facets of human experience. Just so long as the issue of religion is never brought up. If faith is mentioned, even in passing or by a disinterested third party there is an immediate hostile silence toward anyone who has made their unbelief public knowledge. This is a phenomena that genuinely puzzles me. Seems awfully freudian but who really knows?

I can totally understand the social network thing. I feel that too. In fact I regularly consider going to my wife’s Episcopalian church with her ... until Sunday morning comes along. I have a few friends who go there already, and I do like the meditative ritual of their services (and the music and the architecture—it’s all a very comfortable, communal and peaceful setting for me). It’s just a matter of time before I become a member of that community, even if as kind of an outsider, or more likely just an ideological outsider who’s accepted as an insider (that’s the way the whole group/community schtick usually works for me). I don’t get why people feel the need to get on the Kool-Aid though ... never have.

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 06:40 AM

I can totally understand the social network thing. I feel that too. In fact I regularly consider going to my wife’s Episcopalian church with her ... until Sunday morning comes along. I have a few friends who go there already, and I do like the meditative ritual of their services (and the music and the architecture—it’s all a very comfortable, communal and peaceful setting for me). It’s just a matter of time before I become a member of that community, even if as kind of an outsider, or more likely just an ideological outsider who’s accepted as an insider (that’s the way the whole group/community schtick usually works for me). I don’t get why people feel the need to get on the Kool-Aid though ... never have.

I don’t think they do. Or not all of them. It’s just that we don’t get to pick our starting pace. I didn’t shop around for a church community. I was born into one and all my formative experiences happened there. We are largely the sum of our childhood trauma. Fleeing to whatever refuge is available. I’m lucky to live in a liberal community where I can nosh and sing with outspoken atheists. But this situation is the exception. Much of my family lives in rural midwestern america. Where you either praise jesus or live your life as a leper. I’d probably do the same thing.

As for why this particular superstition is the prevailing flavor… probably just dumb luck. America will probably be mostly mormon in a hundred years.

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 06:41 AM

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

Scores points with parole boards.

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:00 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 06:41 AM

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

Scores points with parole boards.

Indeed.  Most parole boards I’ve sat in on are quite wise to that ploy.

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 07:05 AM

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:00 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 06:41 AM

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

Scores points with parole boards.

Indeed.  Most parole boards I’ve sat in on are quite wise to that ploy.

Yet I’d bet it still works well with many or most, and even with many or most boards which are wise to it.

I get the social thing too. For one thing, my religious experiences growing up in the church were largely positive—we were (and my parents still are) United Church of Christ, a fairly innocuous well-meaning liberal Protestant denomination. No hellfire or brimstone, plenty of ecumenical spirit regarding other denominations, faiths, and even non-believers, plenty of blandly well-meaning sermons about doing good and not judging, that sort of thing.

I have a lot of good memories of my childhood in that church; the fellowship, Bible camp in summer, Sunday School, church camp, Haunted houses, confirmation classes, Christmas caroling, and just the socializing on Sundays and otherwise. My parents were very active in the church; it was the center of our social life. I spent a good chunk of my childhood in that building (it was, for a small Midwestern town, a pretty cool building, built in the early 20th century and had a lot of character) and with the other members of the congregation. I have as many good childhood memories of my time in that church as I do of my time in school.

Since we live 1300 miles from my home in Nebraska, and 3000 miles from my wife’s home in the Balkans, I have sometimes wondered if we might have had an easier time making friends, becoming part of our community, and creating a social network had we joined one of the many local churches around here. As a bonus, our son would have some basic “religious literacy” which I think does come in culturally—he’s always missing Biblical references and jokes in popular culture because he’s never been exposed to any religious dogma or scripture at all.

So yeah, I get it too.

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:11 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 07:05 AM

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:00 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 06:41 AM

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

Scores points with parole boards.

Indeed.  Most parole boards I’ve sat in on are quite wise to that ploy.

Yet I’d bet it still works well with many or most, and even with many or most boards which are wise to it.

Many are wise in the sense that they know a person with their back to the wall will likely say anything. But I doubt they are wise enough to be actually objective about a variety of confessions. In other words, a profession of christianity may not help you. But a profession of anything else cannot POSSIBLY help you. Claiming christ is the safety.

Brick Bungalow - 13 January 2012 08:20 AM

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:11 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 07:05 AM

SkepticX - 13 January 2012 07:00 AM

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 06:41 AM

The only people I’ve met who “found god” as an adult were those in some personal mess, alcohol or in jail.  Quite often those in prison lost god as soon as they were released.

Scores points with parole boards.

Indeed.  Most parole boards I’ve sat in on are quite wise to that ploy.

Yet I’d bet it still works well with many or most, and even with many or most boards which are wise to it.

Many are wise in the sense that they know a person with their back to the wall will likely say anything. But I doubt they are wise enough to be actually objective about a variety of confessions. In other words, a profession of christianity may not help you. But a profession of anything else cannot POSSIBLY help you. Claiming christ is the safety.

Beats claiming you’re an atheist.  The louder the claim, the more it is likely to be a con.

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 08:37 AM

Beats claiming you’re an atheist.

Yeah, no kidding! I’m sure that would be inadvisable, unless the prisoner is sacrificing himself to make a political point of it (if that would have any actual chance of working).

Dennis Campbell - 13 January 2012 08:37 AM

The louder the claim, the more it is likely to be a con.

Yeah, I’m sure there’s at least enough actual, realized, rubber actually hitting the road skepticism that some, maybe many, fail to pull off the act so that it actually fails to have any positive effect (likely goes South on them instead).