Forum members : sometime life just doesn’t seem to have room enough for delving into even the things we are interested in, so we make do with a few pieces of information we hear or read and have to get about our business. Well, here is an article that will help put the pieces together in a comparatively short amount of time ; from “Citizen Warrior ” , one of the better blogs . Read it and gain perspective right away .

Warning to the West

The following is an email we received from a former Muslim. We are reprinting it with his permission:

I was born and raised as Muslim. My name is Abdul Rahman. My whole family is still Muslim. I know the Islamic brain very well. I have lived and breathed with them. I am an insider. I left Islam when I understood Islam is a sick and evil religion. Muslims can fool the gullible West but can’t fool us, the ex-Muslims. On this basis I write the following.

Fighting terrorism is easier than fighting the evil teachings of Islam. These evil teachings are already inside the West. Muslims do not need Osama Bin Laden or Zarqawi to lead them. Their inspiration for violence comes directly from the Quran and from Islamic history. One small independent group of Muslims in the West can create havoc.

Ali Sina, of FaithFreedom.org, thinks he can bring down this 1400 years old religion in his lifetime. Is he dreaming? How can you defeat an enemy who has the following agenda? Also remember that the greatest strength of Muslims is that they do not read any site or books that talk against Islam. Most Muslims do not even read the Quran in their own language.

Who will tell you the truth about Islam? Muslims? Of course not. Muslims can’t even see the evil in Islam. The West? The gullible West has no clue. Then who? Ex-Muslims and ex-Muslims only can expose Islam to the West.

Muslims believe Islam will rule the world, very soon. They are committed to it. The constitution for the new Islamic Republic of EU and USA is under construction. Welcome to the 21st Century Islamic Warfare. To the infidels of the West, Muslims say: We will fight the infidel to death. And they mean it.

Meanwhile, Muslims are able to say with complete confidence:

American laws will protect us.

Democrats and Leftist will support us.

The UNO will legitimize us.

CAIR and MAB will incubate us.

The ACLU will support us.

Western Universities will educate us.

Mosques in the West will shelter us.

OPEC will finance us.

Moderate Muslims will fertilize us.

Hollywood will love us.

Koffi Annan will publish the politically correct sympathetic statements for Jihadists.

We will use your (West) welfare system.

We will take advantage of American kindness, gullibility, and compassion. When time comes, we will stab America in the back as we did on 9/11 and 7/7, the Islamic way. We will say one thing on the camera (Islam is the religion of peace) and teach another thing (Quran 8:12 Terrorize and behead the infidels wherever you find them) to our children at home.

We will teach our children Islamic supremacy from their earliest childhood. We will take over Europe first and then the U.S. will be the next. We already have a solid ground in the UK, Holland, Sweden, Spain, Italy, Germany, and now in the U.S.

Who are we? We are the “sleeper cells” next door.

At the time of the real fight we will hold our own children as our armor – this is the Islamic way. When American or Israeli troops shoot at us the world will be watching. Imagine, just imagine the news in the world: “Death of Muslim babies by infidels”.

We say to the West: Keep your Nukes in your curio cabinets. Keep your aircraft carriers and high-tech weaponry in the showcase. You can’t use them against us because of your own higher moral standard. We will take the advantage of your (Western) higher moral standard and use it against you. We won’t hesitate to use our children as suicide bombers against you.

The West manufactures their tanks in the factory. We Muslims will manufacture our military force by natural means — by producing more babies. It is cheaper that way. You infidels cannot defeat us. We are 1.2 billion strong and we will double our population again.

Using the Western legal system we will assert our Sharia Laws, slowly but surely.

Moderate Muslims will say there is no link between Islam and terrorism and the West will believe it because the West is so gullible. Moderate Muslims all over the world will inadvertently incubate Jihadists by defending Islam as a religion of peace, by telling this to their children and the world.

There will be more 9/11s in Europe and in America. We will say, “We do not support terrorism but America got what it deserved.”

We will recite the Quran and say Allah-Hu-Akbar before beheading infidels, as we have been doing it. We will videotape those and send them to infidels to watch. The infidels will surrender — ISLAM means surrender.

Islam is the fastest growing religion among convicts in prison all over the word. 30% of French prison inmates are already converted to Islam.

We will use your (Western) own values of kindness against you. You (the West) are destined to lose.

Must be very depressing for you (the West). Isn’t it?

Allah-Hu-Akbar (as we like to say just before beheading you; it means God is Great).

The rules of war and intelligence-gathering that the world has evolved over the last 100 years count on some fundamental laws of humanity. For example there is some Geneva conventions even for the battlefield. For example, even in the battlefield you give enemy a chance to surrender. You do not take random hostages, behead them, videorecord it, and post it on the internet. Generally, a mother will try to save her babies and children — they won’t sacrifice her own babies for her religion. These are basics of morality for the human race and have been for a very long time, even before religions came along.

Modern Islamic warfare did away with all of the above morality. The equation of war has changed. One major mistake the West has made is to believe terrorists need a structural hiarchical power structure to fight an enemy. Islamic teachings prepare Muslims from childhood to act on their own wherever they can — even without the authorization from his/her superiors. No wonder you are seeing so many independent Muslim terrorists all over the world. These are entrepreneur terrorists.

These sleeper cells go beyond national origin, language, race, or citizenship. Terrorists could be British born-and-raised citizens, or American Taliban. There is only one thread that binds them together that is “ISLAM.”

My, our (ex-Muslims’), message to the West is until the West identifies, names, and warns the public who the real enemy is, the West won’t have chance to win this war. The real enemy is “Islam.” As long as , world leaders are afraid to call a spade a spade, and as long as they keep saying in public the blatant lie that “Islam is a religion of peace” — we run the risk losing our freedom.

Most people live in the world of their own when it comes to things like this—they think what’s happening in THEIR world with Islam, Muslims, etc. is an example of how it is in the real world; the vast world out there . And that’s where things get confused, because the problems with Islam-West conflict is not a matter of personal experience only. Look beyond your own life and try to understand what’s happening world-wide. especially if you are one of those who is always worrying about treating Muslims “fairly” and being tolerant enough, generous enough, and obliging enough to them. Those Muslims are well taken care of, so quit worrying and fretting about them. Wake up—and realize the whole damned world has grown to fear offending them .tell the average person that Islam is a badkward religion and watch them grow highly indignant .Look beyond that.

In this current cultural battle of ours, the one you may call ‘Civilization vs. Barbarism’, the true heroes are first and foremost these: The ex-Muslims.

OP is not exaggerating. I think the Muslims in the West are mostly unwitting participants in the evil. Even in the Muslim Societies, Muslims are conscientious people when religion is not a factor. They can be just as kind and loving as any other person. But they willingly submit their conscience to their faith and accept any crime if it is dictated by their religion. Say for example a women is accused of adultery and she is sentenced to be stoned to death. Muslims generally remain silent. They blame the adulterer and not the draconian law. These people could be caring and loving people, yet their conscience can never overcome their faith.

Likewise, Muslims can not be, in general, trusted to turn one of their own who is planning to harm the West.  The exceptions to this .... are just that. Exceptions.

I worry mostly about the Western liberals who provide the cover for them.  By defending their right to build a mosque near the ground zero, being too politically correct not to notice Major Nidal Malik Hasan before he committed 13 murders and wounding many more, or trying to appear religion neutral at the airports by subjecting all men, women and children randomly to the unnecessary abuse.

Western worldview and reality is quite different than that of the Muslim.  If a Muslim believes Quran is the word of God, that Muslim is radical whether practicing Muslim or not.

Bipedal Primate - 21 July 2011 03:59 PM

In this current cultural battle of ours, the one you may call ‘Civilization vs. Barbarism’, the true heroes are first and foremost these: The ex-Muslims.

Right, Bipedal, they risk their lives just by leaving Islam. So do those who speak out loudly and adamantly against it. I read last week that Geert Wilders has been getting more threats on his life that usual since he was acquitted in that trial. Just when he thought he’d be better off.

Apostates from Islam are a very good source , if you want the straight dope on that religion, because they have lived it and you KNOW they have to hate it enough to make that radical move and leave it .

Celal - 21 July 2011 05:10 PM

OP is not exaggerating. I think the Muslims in the West are mostly unwitting participants in the evil. Even in the Muslim Societies, Muslims are conscientious people when religion is not a factor. They can be just as kind and loving as any other person. But they willingly submit their conscience to their faith and accept any crime if it is dictated by their religion. Say for example a women is accused of adultery and she is sentenced to be stoned to death. Muslims generally remain silent. They blame the adulterer and not the draconian law. These people could be caring and loving people, yet their conscience can never overcome their faith.

Likewise, Muslims can not be, in general, trusted to turn one of their own who is planning to harm the West. The exceptions to this .... are just that. Exceptions.

I worry mostly about the Western liberals who provide the cover for them. By defending their right to build a mosque near the ground zero, being too politically correct not to notice Major Nidal Malik Hasan before he committed 13 murders and wounding many more, or trying to appear religion neutral at the airports by subjecting all men, women and children randomly to the unnecessary abuse.

Western worldview and reality is quite different than that of the Muslim. If a Muslim believes Quran is the word of God, that Muslim is radical whether practicing Muslim or not.

Sounds like you have extraordinary insight on the Muslim-West situation, CELAL. That’s uplifting, because so many have an automatic mindset on Islam and refuse to hear anything negative. I blame a lot of that on the attitude of those in the business of relating to the general public. This includes our so-called leaders, politicians, columnists and other writers, religious clap-trappers, and even teachers. When it comes to Islam they live a lie and that ends up as a sort of brainwashing of the public.

And this fear of questioning Islam has spread like a disease across planet. England is embarrassing itself by accommodating Islamists like they would a spoiled child ; a brat of a kid who throws tantrums if he doesn’t get his way. It’s like a Stockholm syndrome or something . It’s the liberal suicide machine and it has happened before—usually before a movement or revolution of some kind.

I always have been aware that there are always Muslims in our towns and cities who seem to be just like ordinary citizens ( except maybe the wearing of the scarves ), but I still insist also, that there is no outstanding sign that even those type are not undisclosed trouble makers. Think of all the would-be terrorists we have been lucky enough to catch before they carried out their job successfully- they were thought to be just “neighbors” too . But where are the voices of the so-called “moderates” when their radical friends or acquaintances commit acts of violence- either domestic or militant ?

An excellent post, Celel

Sheba

Sheba, peace to you
For a fair judge it’s so easy, if X came to me and claim that Y broke his window!  What is the proper judge for that case????? I’ll not say a word before having the Y opinion, may be the X had explode all of his house first?
I’m afraid that non of those Ex-Moslems is an Ex-Moslem, and non of these claims is right I’ll not allow my self to be misled by unidentified personalities. I’ll be a fair person, and will not build my judgments upon one side clams, I’ll allow those Moslems to defend them selves.
Shaba, I’ll do the right that, yourself has to do too, I’ll visit any of their centers or mosques or at least their authentic web sites, I’ll ask them all what I want to ask and hear from them too…..
I’ll request or buy a copy of there holy book, and allow me Sheba and all of the ((Ex-Moslems)) to read it myself, I’ll read all of It cover to cover, and allow me too to judge it my self
I’m afraid if I didn’t do this I’m no longer a fair person, I’ll be a misled person, one eye and one ear person!

have a nice day

I recently watched a 2007 debate of Reza Aslan and Sam Harris.  The west has embraced people like Reza and given him a platform to portray Islam as a misunderstood religion.

Here is an excerpt from the debate which attracted my attention. After Same Harris’s very insightful and reasoned discussion of Islam, this is what Reza Aslan said:

“There is a reason why I don’t write books on neuroscience because I don’t have expertise in neuroscience. I write books on what’s going on in the Muslim World, because I have an “expertise” in what’s going on in the Muslim World. I actually have traveled through the Muslim World. I studied the Muslim World. I understand the conversations that are taking place… I feel like in a sense, I’m in a better position to make judgement on what sort of Socio-religious political developments are taking place within this 1.5 billion number. The statements like there are millions of Muslims have this death cult are “profoundly” inaccurate, are based on nothing but your sort of general impression, of a region and a religion that you have a very surface understanding of.”

If you distill the unnecessary words used down to the gist of his message, he simply said to Sam Harris. You are wrong because you don’t understand Islam. That was his total scholarly response. Of course, when he paused and raised his volume on various words like “profoundly”, he thought he made what said sound profound.

In truth, what he said was total none sense and not worthy of the chair he was sitting in. He used an argument every illiterate Muslim uses everyday, on every forum by simply asserting that you are wrong because you are not Muslim. 

Yet, this is one of the best examples of Islam defenders in the West.

Then again, how a book like Quran can be considered the word of the Creator by anyone who is viewed as an internationally acclaimed writer and scholar of religions is something I will never understand.

And a few hours ago a bomb went off in Oslo, the capitol of Norway. At the same time as some asshole who was dressed as a police officer started shooting civilians at a labor party summer camp on an island.

Bipedal Primate - 22 July 2011 09:38 AM

And a few hours ago a bomb went off in Oslo, the capitol of Norway. At the same time as some asshole who was dressed as a police officer started shooting civilians at a labor party summer camp on an island.

Following that with interest as well.  No good information yet as to who did it.

@ Dennis Campbell

It’s interesting, however, that the guy with the gun apparently was of Nordic origin.

Someone explodes a bomb.  That someone is a Muslim, yelling Allah is great while doing so.  Therefore all 1.5 billion Muslims are people who explode bombs.  The logic of that bothers me.  Some Christian wing-nut kills a doctor, saying God told him to do that; therefore all Christians are wing-nuts.  Same poor logic.  I am bothered by the lack of many reports of other Muslims condemning such acts, though there are a few; and the abundance of mass celebrations of Muslims agreeing with such acts.  If we’re attacked by people claiming they’re doing so because they’re Muslim and we’re not, then I’ve no good choice but to consider “Muslim” as a predictive variable, if not the only one.  We have different Christian factions in Ireland blowing each other up, but we do not assume they’re doing so mostly for religious differences, but political and/or economic.  Maybe the same applies to these instances of bombing.

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 08:40 AM

Sheba, peace to you
For a fair judge it’s so easy, if X came to me and claim that Y broke his window!  What is the proper judge for that case????? I’ll not say a word before having the Y opinion, may be the X had explode all of his house first?
I’m afraid that non of those Ex-Moslems is an Ex-Moslem, and non of these claims is right I’ll not allow my self to be misled by unidentified personalities. I’ll be a fair person, and will not build my judgments upon one side clams, I’ll allow those Moslems to defend them selves.
Shaba, I’ll do the right that, yourself has to do too, I’ll visit any of their centers or mosques or at least their authentic web sites, I’ll ask them all what I want to ask and hear from them too…..
I’ll request or buy a copy of there holy book, and allow me Sheba and all of the ((Ex-Moslems)) to read it myself, I’ll read all of It cover to cover, and allow me too to judge it my self
I’m afraid if I didn’t do this I’m no longer a fair person, I’ll be a misled person, one eye and one ear person!

have a nice day

Samy,

Is it possible for a person, by choice, to become an ex-Muslim?  Many people in the West have repudiated the religion of their birth, changed to another religion or given up all religions. 

Just curious.

Dennis Campbell - 22 July 2011 12:11 PM

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 08:40 AM

Sheba, peace to you
For a fair judge it’s so easy, if X came to me and claim that Y broke his window!  What is the proper judge for that case????? I’ll not say a word before having the Y opinion, may be the X had explode all of his house first?
I’m afraid that non of those Ex-Moslems is an Ex-Moslem, and non of these claims is right I’ll not allow my self to be misled by unidentified personalities. I’ll be a fair person, and will not build my judgments upon one side clams, I’ll allow those Moslems to defend them selves.
Shaba, I’ll do the right that, yourself has to do too, I’ll visit any of their centers or mosques or at least their authentic web sites, I’ll ask them all what I want to ask and hear from them too…..
I’ll request or buy a copy of there holy book, and allow me Sheba and all of the ((Ex-Moslems)) to read it myself, I’ll read all of It cover to cover, and allow me too to judge it my self
I’m afraid if I didn’t do this I’m no longer a fair person, I’ll be a misled person, one eye and one ear person!

have a nice day

Samy,

Is it possible for a person, by choice, to become an ex-Muslim?  Many people in the West have repudiated the religion of their birth, changed to another religion or given up all religions. 

Just curious.

Mr/ Dennis, have peace
Yes it may happen. But since we are in a relative world we have to compare that to Ex-Christian, Ex-Jew, Ex- Atheist,……….. Mostly it can be ignored

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 12:38 PM

Dennis Campbell - 22 July 2011 12:11 PM

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 08:40 AM

Sheba, peace to you
For a fair judge it’s so easy, if X came to me and claim that Y broke his window!  What is the proper judge for that case????? I’ll not say a word before having the Y opinion, may be the X had explode all of his house first?
I’m afraid that non of those Ex-Moslems is an Ex-Moslem, and non of these claims is right I’ll not allow my self to be misled by unidentified personalities. I’ll be a fair person, and will not build my judgments upon one side clams, I’ll allow those Moslems to defend them selves.
Shaba, I’ll do the right that, yourself has to do too, I’ll visit any of their centers or mosques or at least their authentic web sites, I’ll ask them all what I want to ask and hear from them too…..
I’ll request or buy a copy of there holy book, and allow me Sheba and all of the ((Ex-Moslems)) to read it myself, I’ll read all of It cover to cover, and allow me too to judge it my self
I’m afraid if I didn’t do this I’m no longer a fair person, I’ll be a misled person, one eye and one ear person!

have a nice day

Samy,

Is it possible for a person, by choice, to become an ex-Muslim?  Many people in the West have repudiated the religion of their birth, changed to another religion or given up all religions. 

Just curious.

Mr/ Dennis, have peace
Yes it may happen. But since we are in a relative world we have to compare that to Ex-Christian, Ex-Jew, Ex- Atheist,……….. Mostly it can be ignored

And how does Islam consider and treat those people who have repudiated Islam? Your language skills aren’t that bad, so do not say to me “it can be ignored.”  There are millions of ex-Christians, and some Christian sects are quite punitive toward apostates.  How does Islam consider people who’ve said they no longer believe in Islam?  One woman who has spoken widely in this country, and was a believer in Islam, has been repeatedly threatened with death by Islamic leaders.

Do not say to me “since we live in a relative world..” and then avoid the question.  If you do, then you will have answered my question in a way most on this forum will understand.

Just to be clear, if I can through our language and cultural barriers, I am not your friend.  I am also not your enemy.  You and I are at most just two people trying to communicate across those barriers.  You cannot represent 1.5 billion Islamic people, nor do I represent anyone but myself.  But maybe through our discussions, others will gain some knowledge, as well as you and I.

Dennis Campbell - 22 July 2011 12:45 PM

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 12:38 PM

Dennis Campbell - 22 July 2011 12:11 PM

samy_73 - 22 July 2011 08:40 AM

Sheba, peace to you
For a fair judge it’s so easy, if X came to me and claim that Y broke his window!  What is the proper judge for that case????? I’ll not say a word before having the Y opinion, may be the X had explode all of his house first?
I’m afraid that non of those Ex-Moslems is an Ex-Moslem, and non of these claims is right I’ll not allow my self to be misled by unidentified personalities. I’ll be a fair person, and will not build my judgments upon one side clams, I’ll allow those Moslems to defend them selves.
Shaba, I’ll do the right that, yourself has to do too, I’ll visit any of their centers or mosques or at least their authentic web sites, I’ll ask them all what I want to ask and hear from them too…..
I’ll request or buy a copy of there holy book, and allow me Sheba and all of the ((Ex-Moslems)) to read it myself, I’ll read all of It cover to cover, and allow me too to judge it my self
I’m afraid if I didn’t do this I’m no longer a fair person, I’ll be a misled person, one eye and one ear person!

have a nice day

Samy,

Is it possible for a person, by choice, to become an ex-Muslim?  Many people in the West have repudiated the religion of their birth, changed to another religion or given up all religions. 

Just curious.

Mr/ Dennis, have peace
Yes it may happen. But since we are in a relative world we have to compare that to Ex-Christian, Ex-Jew, Ex- Atheist,……….. Mostly it can be ignored

And how does Islam consider and treat those people who have repudiated Islam? Your language skills aren’t that bad, so do not say to me “it can be ignored.”  There are millions of ex-Christians, and some Christian sects are quite punitive toward apostates.  How does Islam consider people who’ve said they no longer believe in Islam?  One woman who has spoken widely in this country, and was a believer in Islam, has been repeatedly threatened with death by Islamic leaders.

Do not say to me “since we live in a relative world..” and then avoid the question.  If you do, then you will have answered my question in a way most on this forum will understand.

Just to be clear, if I can through our language and cultural barriers, I am not your friend.  I am also not your enemy.  You and I are at most just two people trying to communicate across those barriers.  You cannot represent 1.5 billion Islamic people, nor do I represent anyone but myself.  But maybe through our discussions, others will gain some knowledge, as well as you and I.

Mr. Dennis,Peace to those who seeks the truth,
take it easy, allow me to be objective and you too..

My personal opinion is let him be as he like to be.  Most of the Moslem theologian supports that opinion, here is their evidences from the holly Quran.
256. There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error. And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm hand hold which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower     (2-256)

137. Lo! those who believe, then disbelieve and then (again) believe, then disbelieve, and then increase in disbelief, Allah will never pardon them, nor will He guide them unto a way. (4-137)

32. For that cause We decreed for the Children of Israel (and you too) that whosoever killeth a human being for other than man slaughter or orruption in the earth, it shall be as if be had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had: saved the life of all mankind. Our messengers came unto them of old with clear proofs (of Allah’s sovereignty) , but afterwards lo! many of them became prodigals in the earth.  (5-32)

And if thy Lord willed, all who are in the earth would have believed together. Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers?(10-99)

6. Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion. (109-6)

Practically, Islamic history tells us almost no thing about any cases has been killed for apostasy.

The most arguable case just few years ago, an Egyptian Dr/ Nasr Abu Alyazeed, when the court judged him with apostasy it requisted from his wife to leave him until he repent. That’s every thing.

allow me to add this part for objectivity,
Can we compare such problem with what happened in Europe for 300 years between the Catholic and Protestant, and before that between the eastern Roman orthodox and western Roman Catholic. Compare too with the power of the pop and priests there to kill any person without the slightest fair judgment, in fact to burn them alive on the cross, can we ask Copper Nikos and Galaliluo?

Samy,

I asked how your culture now and you consider and treat these people, not what the Koran says.  I suspect you have less information about that, or claim less, than I do. I’m beginning to think you’re not a good representative of your culture.  Or I am not articulate enough.