gooddogbaddog01 - 20 September 2011 06:22 AM

GAD - 19 September 2011 02:17 PM

unsmoked - 19 September 2011 11:25 AM

I propose that we change the topic title to WHAT BASIS FOR ABSURDITY DOES THEISM OFFER?

 

Awesome!!

Let’s assume, for the moment, that theism (or the supernatural) provides the basis for reason.  What might one’s reasoning look like with this basis?

When good things happen . . .
1.  The deity is pleased with me
2.  Or, it could be a test to see if I will remain faithful to the deity, if I will become proud or remain humble, or to see it I will succumb to any number of other temptations.
3.  Or it could be a set-up, and the devil is tempting me
4.  Or it could be the result of the deity’s gracious pleasure to bless me for no apparent reason whatsoever

When bad things happen . . .
1.  The deity is unpleased with me because of a besetting sin(s), which needs to be corrected in order to enter into the deity’s good graces again
2.  The deity is testing me, to see if I will remain faithful to the deity and be “refined” through the firery trial
3.  The deity is allowing the devil to tempt me, once again

But no matter what, I can remain comforted by the fact that the deity is working all things together for my “good.” (sovereign narcissim)

There is no reasoning here.  It is up to me to arbitrarily decide on the interpretation of events and pick the one that helps me feel the best, and no matter how I interpret (i.e. reason) it, I can always back it up by the appeal to my deity (It’s God’s will).

I really like that framing. If I may I’ve made it a bit more symmetrical. 

When good things happen . . .
1.  The deity is pleased with me and is rewarding me
2.  The deity is testing me to see if I will remain faithful after receiving rewards
3.  The deity is rewarding me as part of a larger plan that serves his will
4.  It is really the devil tempting my faith

When bad things happen . . .
1.  The deity is displeased with me and is punishing me
2.  The deity is testing me to see if I will remain faithful after receiving punishment
3.  The deity is punishing me as part of a larger plan that serves his will
4.  It is really the devil testing my faith

Matthew Durham - 20 September 2011 07:17 AM

gooddogbaddog01 - 20 September 2011 06:22 AM

GAD - 19 September 2011 02:17 PM

unsmoked - 19 September 2011 11:25 AM

I propose that we change the topic title to WHAT BASIS FOR ABSURDITY DOES THEISM OFFER?

 

Awesome!!

Let’s assume, for the moment, that theism (or the supernatural) provides the basis for reason.  What might one’s reasoning look like with this basis?

When good things happen . . .
1.  The deity is pleased with me
2.  Or, it could be a test to see if I will remain faithful to the deity, if I will become proud or remain humble, or to see it I will succumb to any number of other temptations.
3.  Or it could be a set-up, and the devil is tempting me
4.  Or it could be the result of the deity’s gracious pleasure to bless me for no apparent reason whatsoever

When bad things happen . . .
1.  The deity is unpleased with me because of a besetting sin(s), which needs to be corrected in order to enter into the deity’s good graces again
2.  The deity is testing me, to see if I will remain faithful to the deity and be “refined” through the firery trial
3.  The deity is allowing the devil to tempt me, once again

But no matter what, I can remain comforted by the fact that the deity is working all things together for my “good.” (sovereign narcissim)

There is no reasoning here.  It is up to me to arbitrarily decide on the interpretation of events and pick the one that helps me feel the best, and no matter how I interpret (i.e. reason) it, I can always back it up by the appeal to my deity (It’s God’s will).

Indeed.  When all possible events can only serve to confirm what you already believed was true in the first place, it should be clear to all that you are not concerned with your beliefs reflecting reality as it is.  Rather, your concern is with attempting to make reality conform with what you arbitrarily think it should be.

Neither is Reason the overriding concern.

GAD - 20 September 2011 07:33 AM

I really like that framing. If I may I’ve made it a bit more symmetrical. 

When good things happen . . .
1.  The deity is pleased with me and is rewarding me
2.  The deity is testing me to see if I will remain faithful after receiving rewards
3.  The deity is rewarding me as part of a larger plan that serves his will
4.  It is really the devil tempting my faith

When bad things happen . . .
1.  The deity is displeased with me and is punishing me
2.  The deity is testing me to see if I will remain faithful after receiving punishment
3.  The deity is punishing me as part of a larger plan that serves his will
4.  It is really the devil testing my faith

Much clearer. Thanks.

Maybe I can Google “How do I delete a message on Project Reason?”

Hi each and all.

Sorry I still haven’t responded to GoodDogBadDog’s very useful summary, because of study.

I hope to respond by next weekend.

Thanks again for it, and for people’s vigorous participation generally.

Ciao for now.

Justaskin - 22 September 2011 09:45 PM

Maybe I can Google “How do I delete a message on Project Reason?”

Ask a moderator.

Nhoj Morley - 22 September 2011 10:40 PM

Justaskin - 22 September 2011 09:45 PM

Maybe I can Google “How do I delete a message on Project Reason?”

Ask a moderator.

renamed to adminisrtator?

Ok, Nhoj, how does one delete a message? I seem to remember trying to find that function once before - it was one morning after reading a message I’d posted the night before when I’d been on the turps. So, just for future reference…

Die fröhliche Wissenschaft (Rob) - 23 September 2011 04:41 AM

Ok, Nhoj, how does one delete a message? I seem to remember trying to find that function once before - it was one morning after reading a message I’d posted the night before when I’d been on the turps. So, just for future reference…

Quickest way to have a post deleted:  Add a link to porn, golf-club sales, or asian import clothing?

Do I win a prize if I guess right? 

We don’t recommend self-deletion, but if you must….

Hit the “edit” button under your post. Select All in the text box and delete. Leave a period or space behind.

To make the box go away, please re-edit your post to say “make this box go away, please”. Send $19.95 to our home address in an envelope marked “Corruption”. Wait six to eight weeks. Results may vary.

Jefe - 23 September 2011 05:53 AM

Die fröhliche Wissenschaft (Rob) - 23 September 2011 04:41 AM

Ok, Nhoj, how does one delete a message? I seem to remember trying to find that function once before - it was one morning after reading a message I’d posted the night before when I’d been on the turps. So, just for future reference…

Quickest way to have a post deleted:  Add a link to porn, golf-club sales, or asian import clothing?

Do I win a prize if I guess right? 

Nailed it!

Guess I should have know better than to ask a straight(?) question. Must keep’em camp and cryptic in future. More chance of a straight answer that way.

Hi everyone

Just a quick note to say that I do intend to reply, in about a month.

Again, sincere apologies for the delay, but study pressures and the excitement of a revolution on Wall Street have impeded.

I would also like to read some stuff by Daniel Dennett, before replying, in addition to reviewing people’s posts and my thoughts on how exactly molecules can accord with reason (both the process of reasoning and the proposed supernatural reason).

Thanks again for your patience,

JA